Why So Curious? Cultivating Inquiring Minds in Online Learning
In today's show - Amalie and Alex discuss how to foster the necessary trait of curiosity. For instructors in fully online programs, cultivating this may seem tricky, but there are simple and effective practices which encourage students to go deeper and become lifelong learners.
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Transcript
Actually figured out how we solved the issue of how to keep students curious in online courses like I know.
::What it is?
::You ready for it?
::OK, sex, drugs and rock'n'roll.
::Ohh well, in that case that's all you need.
::That's all that you need.
::All you gotta put in your online course and people are hooked.
::Welcome to the pedagogy toolkit. In this episode, Alex Anomaly will discuss fostering curiosity and the online classroom. Stay tuned.
::No, I think it's more. I think we we put this down as a topic because it was more along the lines of have we ever had those instances where students have questioned relevancy of course material or they just don't seem to grasp the why or what's actually important in that. Have you ever experienced that from your teaching time or?
::Ohh my gosh every day.
::I feel like I experienced that as well. I always used to get that when I was teaching just English because the students would go.
::I know I had one say. I know how to.
::Read that's all English is, yeah.
::I said I know how to read, I can read that sign. I can read that clock. I don't need a whole class for this. And I was like, wow, OK, we got we got.
::Work to do.
::UM, now I'm teaching well similar class to one that you're teaching Alex. That is a a mandatory introductory freshman first year seminar. How to college class and a lot of them. A lot of the students fully expect that to be either things they already know.
::Things they'll never use or a waste of their time and money.
::It's a challenge to spark as we're going to say here spark curiosity like why do I need to know this and why or what even encourages me to go deeper beyond what's being presented here.
::Because that's probably.
::You know more often, as I reflect on my time in learning.
::In my education, it's not even.
::Yes, there are certain foundational principles, concepts, applications that I need to know, but more often the goal has been.
::How to think more deeply and how to critically think and how to critically analyze and how to then take these tools and these skill sets that I've been given through by education, and then use them myself?
::To go deeper, sure the.
::The curiosity.
::Is.
::Is the motor for that. It's sort of what drives us to to look further, to look deeper, to look more. I've had it. I've seen it explained really well, as I mean, curiosity is by definition is trying to fill gaps in knowledge. So it's it. You have this piece.
::And this piece and this piece and you don't know what comes between them and curiosity is the drive to figure out what comes between all those pieces.
::OK.
::The part for an instructor is knowing which pieces to present to the students, which pieces to leave out.
::And then how to sort of turn on the engine to get them to figure out where those pieces go and where?
::Exactly. And in a typical class.
::That's hard enough when you are already having to think about differentiated instruction just to pick up basic concepts and achieve basic objectives, and then where we work, throw that in the online space.
::Where you're not even getting real time feedback from students, you're not sure, even if they're engaging with the most basic foundational information you're presenting to them in the form of your lectures, your material, your reading.
::Although sometimes it's not the case in the face to face anyway, how many times you show up and they didn't do the reading, but even less so in the online space. How do we?
::It can probably feel like an uphill battle, I would imagine, for a lot of instructors, like I'm trying to get them to simply just engage with the primary level.
::Of interest and engagement, which are inextricably linked essentially to curiosity.
::How am I even expected? Or how can I even hope to get them to want to go to a secondary or tertiary level with their thinking in this?
::I think one of the first things that we realized when we switch from teaching face to face to teaching online is we we never realize until then how much we rely on our sparkling personalities to get. I mean, how much literally how much we we deal on the how much we we rely on the personal and the.
::The performative nature of teaching face to face that you've got to switch to a different kind of performance and a different kind of.
::Setting the stage up differently than you would.
::Yeah, I mean it, it really does. It feels like we're starting off more with there are barriers to making people curious and online courses more so than there are advantages. I love that line from the book from Grasp, which is a.
::Book that we've.
::Multiple IDs here in the office or a different.
::State have you?
::Read the whole thing. I'm probably 3.
::Quarters of the way through. OK. And then James, I know is about 40% the way through and I'm like 10%.
::It's one that I pick up. I go, I keep coming back to and.
::Picking up and and.
::Yeah. Yeah. Doctor Sanjay Sharma at MIT. Yeah. And he's just got a great.
::Getting you Nuggets?
::Introduction into the the world of educational theory and how we how we learn and how technology plays a role in that. But I loved the the little quote here of making information available is not the same as providing an education and then applying that into the concept of curiosity. How do we? We can't if we rely on our online learning as basically just a reservoir.
::Of material that isn't going to spark curiosity that is going to drive engagement because you've essentially you, you may have a treasure box of information, but all you've done is open. You've given them the treasure box and told them to open it and now it's OK. Now what do I do with all this?
::Right.
::I keep thinking about.
::Like one of my my analogies that I come back to is the instructor as kind of guardrails the bumpers in.
::In a bowling alley and but I think of just giving them the information is like just setting the bowling ball down at the front of the lane and walking away. And then there's no, there's no motion, there's no push, there's no. And they're without curiosity, there's no.
::Yeah.
::Yeah. And in in some instances, depending on the type of class, the level of the student.
::This maybe this is their first time ever stepping foot in a bowling alley. Maybe they don't know what bowling is, and you've brought them into the alley. You've sat them down. I.
::Mean they get them a.
::And the ball, there's the pins down there. You know what's going on? You know what you need them to do? You've even made it a little bit more advantageous for them by setting up bumpers.
::But are they going to kick the?
::Ball, I'm like. Now I'm picturing those America's funniest home videos, things where people are are basically like trying to baseball Chuck with ball down an alley. So yeah.
::Yeah, and that may be kind of to another point.
::Their curiosity is going to be limited when competence doesn't match, we we can often, I think, come into.
::Learning and online learning in particular with.
::A lack of awareness of the foundational knowledge that everyone's bringing to the table, so that's where even introducing.
::Introductory pre evaluation components can actually be ironically like a spark to curiosity, because then you're able to differentiate instruction and create scaffolding into your learning in a way that really makes.
::OK, this student clearly grasps these concepts, but here's where I can provide resources that will point them in a deeper direction. This student may be the different level. Yes, they've met the prerequisites that get them into this course, but that doesn't necessarily mean they're engaging and interested at the same.
::Same level and what that makes.
::That's. Yeah, that's meeting meeting students where they are and being able to kind of bring them along with you. I think those kinds of things can also, if they're done well, can provide some confidence to the students to let them know that they sometimes they know more than they think they do and.
::There's there's all sorts of classes and learning happens over time, so they may not think they learned anything. I didn't think I learned any French, and then I went to France.
::And was like ohh.
::I know what that means. I know what that means. I know that that all these things that I didn't realize I had learned them. And so yeah, I think my confidence level was different.
::And did you come away from that than wanting?
::To know it more. Yeah, I did. Which?
::Actually it's that's like in that's in real practical application like building on your. Yeah, your curiosity, you're you're wanting to fill those gaps because you see I've actually I'm further down the road than I thought I was maybe I can get even further.
::If I fill.
::These these, these gaps of knowledge and these gaps, and then I could do what they're doing over there and that's actually really cool and I could.
::Right.
::Yeah, that's exactly what it is. Yeah.
::And so I think that's where the instructor has to be more proactive in playing that role of really investigator of your students being a good learner of your learners.
::Yes.
::And the online space that does take an additional step, not just assuming prerequisites are enough, but really trying to glean through evaluation of their their responses, introductory activities if you can facilitate pre.
::Pre test material or foundational knowledge material and then kind of gauge where they're at with it and that that's going to get them a leg up. Another barrier that I think is maybe sometimes just so overlooked and this is where we as instructional designers have to really play a key role I think is just those.
::Especially in the online courses.
::The learning management system can sometimes be so cumbersome or so structured in a way that.
::Becomes too much, too much of A tax on their cognitive bandwidth that they can't. They're just getting in, trying to navigate the system, figure out how to use Blackboard, or how to post this or how to upload this. No, you can't expect them to then go deeper with your knowledge because or with their learning because.
::Our brains are every day looking at at rate of return.
::And return on investment and investment of our time. And when you when you open up something like that and you think is this even worth my time?
::Yeah.
::This class that I think is stupid that I don't want.
::To take in.
::The first place why? Why am I going to go to all this trouble to get into something that I think is pointless for me anyway? I mean you.
::Yeah.
::You've already set yourself up for.
::A bad time.
::Right. And so as an instructor, that's where especially.
::One is teaching online. They have to think through this the flow of the course, how it's set up isn't just going to make sense to me as the instructor, it has to make sense to anyone who could come into this course.
::Are they going to know exactly where to find my intro material? Are they going to know how to automatically submit? And then if I can take that off of them where they aren't having to worry about it and they can just open up and really wrestle with the content.
::Then you're providing space because they're not arguing or fighting with. OK, well, where's you? You said to read this document and then go submit here. And then I had to.
::Yeah.
::Spend 5 minutes looking for.
::Figuring out where here is and.
::Where here is and. Yeah, just it's it's subtle, but it it makes a huge difference in how we label how we structure and how.
::Create that user experience and so that's where again, as instructional designers, we can be that resource for online instructors to make sure that there is a best practice in place.
::And we.
::We've talked a lot in in other episodes about the importance of having desirable difficulties. That difficulty is one of the key.
::Ingredients in learning.
::That having to work for something is a little bit, but you want desirable difficulties, not unnecessary difficulties. The you're piling too many difficulties on focus on the ones that are really going to get the most bang for your buck.
::Yeah, unless your students are in the information Systems Department, they don't need to be getting frustrated with how to navigate the information system of Blackboard or the the learning content that you're facilitating. They need to be frustrated by the concepts of the content to work through them, not what's housing.
::You want them to spend all their energy.
::The content.
::The trying to work through those difficulties of getting to the content.
::Yeah, we want to, we want to create the space that's smooth, that's available for them to immediately get in. And then once they're in, I think we can spend some time here just talking about some of those practical strategies for fostering that curiosity. And I think self-directed learning.
::Neglect students if they come to you and you have maybe a term paper or a specific.
::Formative or cumulative project and you know there are certain goals or objectives they need to meet for competency, but they throw a curveball at you and they want to facilitate it in a different format or they have a slightly different spin on the topic. But you see they're taking the initiative to reach out, to ask if that's possible.
::You know you can always say no if their suggestion isn't going to meet the actual goal or objective, but if they are.
::On board with it and it does tick those boxes allow like let that let that interest fly.
::All of my.
::All of my projects when I give because I almost always give options within a project, I rarely tell them they have to do 1 specific thing because usually I'm I'm actually assessing skills and not specific. Like can they write a paper? I'm not. I'm.
::I'm assessing not their writing skills necessarily. I'm I'm assessing their summary skills or their analysis skills, so I can usually I always have one option that's just called a wild card that says do you have another idea come talk to me and at the same time you'll end up with students who go.
::Yeah.
::Well, I'm not interested in anything. They will actually say that I'm not interested in anything or I don't know. I don't know what to do. I don't know what to do. And that's where those questioning strategies can come in that we've talked about in other episodes of asking those questions to help them learn how to ask questions themselves that are at the root of curiosity.
::Right.
::This one probably pushes a little bit more into the.
::Curated difficulty, but collaborative efforts, group work group projects, because we all know the the horror stories of group projects or collaborative projects. But if they're done well, and if they're structured in a way that.
::Yep.
::Does facilitate good peer-to-peer collaboration and communication. They're getting a chance to work with.
::Others in the content with different perspectives who could point things out to them that.
::They.
::Didn't see or understand, especially in the online space that's that's so necessary.
::And having.
::Having a peer push you is often going to be more effective than having a an instructor push you too. And I don't mean push like getting in trouble, push but like but you know getting you to think more about something you're often going to respond better to a peer.
::Yeah, yeah, yeah.
::Then.
::To to me telling you, you have to think harder, but you're also leveraging the social learning piece. You're also leveraging that. Want not wanting to let down your peers.
::If you can sort of build the rapport in a group early on, yeah, that rapport can carry over to. I don't want to let my teammates down and I've seen plenty of students do that where they they know they can't complete some part of it and say I'm really worried about how this is going to get done because I don't want to.
::Let everybody else down, right?
::And so much of that can be established early on, say it's a.
::A project or a report that doesn't come until halfway through the the course or towards the end of the course. That's where early student to student interaction, and of course really helps those students make those connections so that they're not just dropped in halfway through, you know, so early discussion.
::Activities early.
::Just even activities that require them to provide peer-to-peer, peer-to-peer feedback, and then introduce proper netiquette and how to how to engage with one another in the online space.
::I'm actually working with an instructor right now that we're talking about how to incorporate some group work in, and one of the things we've talked about is.
::Going ahead and using Blackboard to establish groups at the beginning and then assign discussion prompts on a group level so that all their discussion happens in that small group of five to seven students. So it's it keeps it a little more targeted, a little bit so later on.
::Yeah.
::OK. Yeah.
::At week 12, when they have to start working on a group project, they've already developed a rapport with each other and can can start to develop something that way.
::Yeah. And probably by having a smaller group of five to six students in discussion.
::Students can't hide in a discussion board of 50 as easily. You know the if if there's four voices going on and the one person hasn't posted it's it's pretty obvious.
::You don't.
::Yeah, and they can even say, hey, Emily, do you have any thoughts that you?
::Want to contribute to this and like I'm not saying you shame as a motivator, but there is this. There is this social aspect to learning that we have to we have to manufacture at every place we can in the online space because it's not naturally.
::And.
::No.
::There, yeah.
::And that's where that's where establishing proper netiquette is so critical, and modeling that as the instructor through instructor feedback, there was my little segue in there. I think this is again another way.
::Yes, look at you.
::To not just provide analysis or summary of the work that's been completed checking off, especially if you are using rubrics and do they meet this? Do they? If if you have a student that meets every component.
::In a particular project or paper, not just leaving it as great job but using that then as a space. OK, they they clearly. So yeah. If you clearly have grasp of this concept, have you considered?
::So if this then.
::That, that phrase right there could push students into a new level of understanding, or a new desire to bridge a new gap. So hey, you've gotten this. Let me talk to you about this or let me open up this new door to you. I know for me and my personal learning and things that I enjoy, I that's where I see tons of value in those folks who are.
::Subject matter experts, or even just 5-10 years ahead of Maine in learning because they've already kind of had those conversations with others or they've gone on those journeys themselves. And I know that's a process I can't get to their level where they're at right now, where I'm at right now. I need those doors unlocked so that I can start to explore.
::And so, yeah, and even if those those questions are raised, that's.
::That's, I don't know, not be a point.
::That's well and that's how to establish what what's called in K12 ext is. That's how you differentiate in your classroom. That's how you make sure that the students who need more support to get to the baseline.
::You ask them those questions to get them to the baseline, but the students who have exceeded your baseline, that doesn't mean there isn't anywhere else that they can get like they're they're not. That's not the end. And you being able to ask questions that prompt them to push further is extending their learning.
::Yeah. Back to questioning strategies. They they apply in all the iterations of your students who come to you with. I don't even know. And those students who like I already know.
::Mm-hmm.
::The other nice thing and I will give this the with questions. If you use questions and you are sparking curiosity, what that does is it kind of.
::Allows the student to feel in charge of the learning and that that it's their idea, even if what you did was ask a question that you knew was going to lead them to that idea, you've allowed them to come to it themselves. And that's that's motivating too. That breeds more curiosity that creates more push.
::Yeah, this isn't a courtroom. Leading questions are perfectly acceptable.
::Perfectly.
::There's no judge that's going.
::To strike that.
::Down.
::We just have a few more here. I think one of the other ones that's just so, so.
::Will.
::And I think more often than not, instructors are at deploying this, but finding it to to even work in the smallest of examples and use cases can continue to to enhance curiosity is just finding a real world application for every concept or every lesson or every instruction you're trying to deploy again, that addresses that whole. Why does this matter? Why am I using it?
::Yes.
::But anytime and again, this applies to every single discipline out there, but anchored.
::Yeah.
::In it.
::In a real world application or real world question will always almost always I should say go further than hypothetical. There's probably a few niche examples someone to pull out there where we're only working in hypotheticals, but that's not the case for the lion's share.
::Well.
::This is where though you can use case studies. You can build case studies. You can have students create their own case studies.
::Absolutely.
::That that helps them, that their peers solve kind of you know that their peers analyze because then they're having to think about all the pieces and that can be done in pretty much any discipline.
::Yeah. Oh, absolutely. Absolutely. The last component is just essentially encouraging research and critical thinking. I think the.
::Building case studies.
::Prime Indicator of is a student. Genuinely curious is how much are they independent?
::The.
::Pursuing right, they're learning outside of what is required or mandated and when you see that in students or when you get a a taste of that in some students, that kind of loops back all the way back to student directed learning. So this maybe book ends, you know, leverage that if they've talked, if they've brought up something that maybe is secondary or tertiary to the goals of your course, but it.
::Aligns with some of your content. How can you encourage them to, you know, close the?
::Loop.
::And say, OK, you're on a good track here, maybe this applies more to this particular aspect of it, but if you?
::To.
::Link it to concept. You know you're thinking a concept CI want you focused on concept A.
::But if I give you.
::The kind of tools to look at B. Maybe you'll connect AB and C all together, and then that actually applies to your.
::Your topic that I want you to focus on or study and so just.
::Again, questioning strategies is where this kind of is baked into every one of these kind of recommendations.
::And that's a lot of that too is modeling it as well, especially for younger students, for freshmen, for students who are just coming into an academic environment, they've come from an environment where they have been.
::Doing exactly what they're told, and that's what they've been rewarded for. And now when they ask something kind of going, if I don't know it go, oh, I don't know, let's.
::Look.
::And then stopping what I'm doing and let's look together. So if you get something on a discussion board and you say, oh, I hadn't thought about, I'm going to go look that up now.
::And come back and say this is something that I found really valuing their input, but also demonstrating that.
::You can take that and go further.
::And I think that kind of leads to the the kind of closing thoughts and all this is.
::That helps foster an environment where curiosity thrives because it's a safe space to not know it's a safe space to ask questions.
::And it's.
::Where the student see the instructor as a fellow learner on the journey with them, they're at a different level.
::That's huge.
::Of the learning? Yeah. Never, never a got you space or a space where.
::They feel nervous to ask a question.
::A question is an is an indication of curiosity like as its foundation.
::It's valued.
::Where we're not knowing, I mean, I always say that this is you want to to really elevate and embrace the power of not knowing something and really leverage that, that, that what a good thing that is.
::Thanks for joining us today on the Pedagogy toolkit. Don't forget to subscribe. We'll see you next time. Thanks.
